Obama's Approval Rate Sinks Below 50%

[Samus-Fan]

According to the daily tracking poll conducted by Rasmussen Reports, the approval rating of President Barack Obama has fallen below 50% for the first time since his inauguration. In a short six months, Mr. Obama has sunk from a high of 65% on Inauguration Day to a low of 49% approval in today’s poll. The consequent 51% disapproval rate makes it the first time that a majority of likely voters give Obama a negative rating.
This development was foreshadowed by other indications in previous days. His Approval Index has been hovering around the -7 mark for some time. The Approval Index is computed by subtracting the number of likely voters who strongly disapprove from those who strongly approve. Today’s index for President Obama showed 30% strongly approving, while 38% strongly disapproved for a -8 score.
More specific polls concerning the Administration’s initiatives help explain his breakneck dive in popularity:
• Only 25% of the sample believes the economic stimulus package is working, while 31% say it has hurt.
• His health care proposal is opposed by 53% of respondents.
• With reference to the country’s direction, 63% say it is going in the wrong direction, while only 31% say it’s headed the right way. The latter number represents a 4-point jump from last week.
• After being essentially tied for months, since the June 28 tracking poll, Republicans have been preferred to Democrats in the generic poll. The Republican lead is now four points. In the generic poll voters are asked which party’s candidate they intend to vote for in their local congressional elections.

The vanishing support for President Obama and his programs must be a cause of alarm for the Democrats, who are obviously trying to ram their agenda through Congress before the American people have an opportunity to react and stop it. It will be a tough race for the parties between now and 2010 to determine the long-term direction of our country.

Full Story (http://www.examiner.com/x-5325-Orlando-Republican-Examiner~y2009m7d24-Obamas-approval-rate-sinks-below-50)

I knew it was gonna happen.
Just needed to post this since this seems to be a rather conservative forum.

[Jaykub]

Drop it like its hot.....
I waited for the day. Didn't think it would be so fast. So damn fast its not funny. I must say its dropped like what 30% lmaforofl.


And the reign will kill us all,

[LiNuX]

Fox News is gonna have a ball with this - full democrat haters there lol. he's still doing better than a lot of presidents - the number fluctuates up and down all the time so I wouldn't be surprised if obama's goes up and then back down again. I'm guessing most people thought He'd end the economic turmoil by now

George Bush still holds the record for ending with 22%, his father did better in one term (and I believe they have separate rankings for one term and two term presidents, fdr is another case)

but we'll have to see how things go and if Obama will be affected enough to throw some more change in the air after this news.

@jacob - the reign will kill us all? what made you come to that conclusion?

[Jaykub]

Fox News is gonna have a ball with this - full democrat haters there lol. he's still doing better than a lot of presidents - the number fluctuates up and down all the time so I wouldn't be surprised if obama's goes up and then back down again. I'm guessing most people thought He'd end the economic turmoil by now

George Bush still holds the record for ending with 22%, his father did better in one term (and I believe they have separate rankings for one term and two term presidents, fdr is another case)

but we'll have to see how things go and if Obama will be affected enough to throw some more change in the air after this news.

@jacob - the reign will kill us all? what made you come to that conclusion?

Oh its song lyrics.

[jakncoke]

Well when people thought Obama was going to turn around this country so fast and reality is setting in on how that's simply not possible. it was bound to happen.

[LiNuX]

Oh its song lyrics.

mm


Well when people thought Obama was going to turn around this country so fast and reality is setting in on how that's simply not possible. it was bound to happen.

yeah, it's kind if ridiculous to think that - it took bush 8 years to crap on the nation's economy and raise its debt to an all time record and people expected Obama to be super president and fix things within a few months. If it was the case I'm sure people would have been all over him but he is on the firey trail that bush left behind - need a lot of water to extinguish 8 years of that...

done with the metaphors.

[Samus-Fan]

George Bush still holds the record for ending with 22%, his father did better in one term (and I believe they have separate rankings for one term and two term presidents, fdr is another case)


After 8 years, he was 22%.
It's been about 8 months, and Obama is under 50%.

[LiNuX]

After 8 years, he was 22%.
It's been about 8 months, and Obama is under 50%.

you're right, it's too early to judge what his overall ratings will be. so trying to throw this in his face is kind of pointless right now because he still has about 3 and a half years left in this term.

[KittyCat72]

You know, I find it difficult to reply to topics like this sometimes because Linux says everything I'm thinking and more before I get the chance. :-P Oh well, I guess my life is easier now, thanx.

[Jaykub]

you're right, it's too early to judge what his overall ratings will be. so trying to throw this in his face is kind of pointless right now because he still has about 3 and a half years left in this term.

I will look at this from both sides.


Obama may go back up in the polls. And there is a great chance this will happen. And right now it is to early to tell anything. But as of right now Obama is dropping very fast. Anyone can see that and if it keeps up the way it has been since he took office then he will be down there with bush in no time.


Obama is really dropping the ball worse then I thought he would and that says something :laugh:

[LiNuX]

I will look at this from both sides.


Obama may go back up in the polls. And there is a great chance this will happen. And right now it is to early to tell anything. But as of right now Obama is dropping very fast. Anyone can see that and if it keeps up the way it has been since he took office then he will be down there with bush in no time.


Obama is really dropping the ball worse then I thought he would and that says something :laugh:

the polls are usually very off, that's why so many people were surprised when obama took a few republican states in the election, including Virginia, everyone though McCain had Virginia locked because of the "polls" - these ratings don't ask anyone - just a select group of people from different states/cities and they basically go with that and different sources have different numbers.

For example, if you look at the final bush ratings, different news sources will show you different results - same for Clinton, and Bush Sr, and Reagan, etc. Lowest for bush was 22% in one place and I believe another place showed him to be 27%.

[Samus-Fan]

Lol, I really, REALLY just find this humorous.

Anything Linux can say to make Obama look better, he'll say.
Let's look at what he has accomplished so far:

He released terrorists from prison.
He gave billions upon billions upon billions of bailouts to Banks.
He gave billions upon billions upon billions of bailouts to car companies.
He spent billions upon billions upon billions of dollars for a Stimulus Package of what, $250 a person to park the economy?
Which, by the way, didn't work.
He is working on National Healthcare.
Which, raises taxes.
Which, makes people who work and earn money pay more.
Which makes them spend less.
Which would make the economy worse.

Need I say more?
If you want me to, I can.

Lets put Healthcare this way, because I guess some of you don't understand.
Government health care raises taxes. Also, Obama wants to eliminate tax cuts on the wealthy...society's biggest contributors! The rich shouldn't be penalized for growing the economy.

EDIT:
Just for fun, I'm adding more.
These were in his first 2 months.

Ran the deficit up even more
Went on Jay Leno and insulted Special Olympics
Went on 60 minutes and laughed about the failing economy

[Yuuki]

I'll give Obama a few months before I cuss him out .__.

[Iceskater101]

Yeah he hasn't been president that long
and sure he made fun of the special olympics but don't other celebrities do that?
where they go on some show or they have a blog or whatever and they make fun of something?

[LiNuX]

Lol, I really, REALLY just find this humorous.

Anything Linux can say to make Obama look better, he'll say.
Let's look at what he has accomplished so far:

He released terrorists from prison.
He gave billions upon billions upon billions of bailouts to Banks.
He gave billions upon billions upon billions of bailouts to car companies.
He spent billions upon billions upon billions of dollars for a Stimulus Package of what, $250 a person to park the economy?
Which, by the way, didn't work.
He is working on National Healthcare.
Which, raises taxes.
Which, makes people who work and earn money pay more.
Which makes them spend less.
Which would make the economy worse.

Need I say more?
If you want me to, I can.

Lets put Healthcare this way, because I guess some of you don't understand.
Government health care raises taxes. Also, Obama wants to eliminate tax cuts on the wealthy...society's biggest contributors! The rich shouldn't be penalized for growing the economy.

EDIT:
Just for fun, I'm adding more.
These were in his first 2 months.

Ran the deficit up even more
Went on Jay Leno and insulted Special Olympics
Went on 60 minutes and laughed about the failing economy

actually my point is to just negate you since you seem to be so against him

and most of the people in guantanamo were detained illegally and most of them were innocent - this is called Habeas Corpus. If you won't have a problem being held without proper evidence or justification without a fair trial just because of your race and what someone else said, by all means, don't be afraid to be honest about it.

And the word "released" wasn't anywhere in the whole Gitmo thing - they are just trying to find other prisons for them and provide fair trials in front of a judge/jury. Where did you hear they released the prisoners? The ones you may have been hearing about are the ones that got their fair trial and were found to be innocent due to the lack of evidence or not having any evidence at all.

The bailouts started with Bush, not Obama.

And there is a lot of people in the country, and it wasn't $250, I remember our family getting a lot more than that. And Bush did that last year too - this isn't an Obama exclusive. It was done by other presidents in the past so you can't really use that here.

National healthcare works in other countries - it's an investment in your own nation, there are millions of americans without health insurance so if you don't want to lend a helping hand, that's on you. It has proven to work in other nations with far less money and power than our own, so why can't it work here?

Again - taxes are a good thing - they don't go to waste, they go back into the roads you drive in, the buildings you visit, the military that protects you, the cops that keep you safe, the teachers that teach you all these things.

Social security = pay back in the end - I've already explained this in another thread of yours

Taxes does not make the economy worse if the Gov't is using it efficiently - and you have no way of knowing how much of the taxes are going into what unless you work with the treasury or a similar department - of course you can research but I can tell you that 99% of those sources are inaccurate to a good percentage point.

Again, taxes aren't penalties - the rich will get most of them back when they retire and get their social security. Key words right there. And how do you know the rich are the biggest contributors to the economy? There are more of the poor than there are of the rich and I can guarantee you that the middle and lower classes spend a LOT more money than the upper class if you look at them as just two different parts rather than comparing one rich guy to one poor guy. The rich doesn't grow the economy, the working class does.

All you try to do is bring up all the negatives about Obama and trying to put the blame of the current economic situation on Obama after just a few months which is pretty sad and desperate in trying to make Obama look like a terrible president because there is nothing else for you to run on. Although you make valid points, you don't "express" them properly (not sure if express is the right word) and it just makes it easy for me to negate what you say.

But again, this "debate" is all fun and games for me - I don't get to debate in the summer as much as when classes are in session so I like the mind stimulation and for future reference, don't try to play the tax card - the questions and answers will remain mostly the same

[Samus-Fan]

Yeah he hasn't been president that long
and sure he made fun of the special olympics but don't other celebrities do that?
where they go on some show or they have a blog or whatever and they make fun of something?

LOL.
You're saying the president is a celebrity?
He should be anything BUT that, he is helping running our nation, he shouldn't be insulting the special olympics.
Btw, Britney Spears is not running our nation.

[LiNuX]

LOL.
You're saying the president is a celebrity?
He should be anything BUT that, he is helping running our nation, he shouldn't be insulting the special olympics.
Btw, Britney Spears is not running our nation.


A celebrity is a person who is famously recognized in a society.

are you saying he's not a celebrity?

you don't have to be a singer or actor to be called a celebrity - a celebrity is someone that's widely known, you can call all politicians celebrities to a certain degree

for example, a senator is probably a huge celebrity in his state, a local congressman in his district, or the president of the United States in the whole world because who doesn't know about the American president? Whether it's obama, bush, clinton, or the older bush.

and as much as you don't like being told how to use your freedom of speech, you can't really tell anyone else either - anyone can say what they want, they are just frowned upon for saying the wrong things at the worst times.

[Jaykub]

A celebrity is a person who is famously recognized in a society.


and there you have it....

[Iceskater101]

LOL.
You're saying the president is a celebrity?
He should be anything BUT that, he is helping running our nation, he shouldn't be insulting the special olympics.
Btw, Britney Spears is not running our nation.

no duh! Britney Spears isn't running our nation because she isn't the president
it seems like every time obama does something wrong you just cuss him out for it....

[Jaykub]

no duh! Britney Spears isn't running our nation because she isn't the president
it seems like every time obama does something wrong you just cuss him out for it....

Every time bush did something wrong heads would roll. but if obama does something we need to leave him alone..

[Iceskater101]

Every time bush did something wrong heads would roll. but if obama does something we need to leave him alone..

Bush was in office for 8 years so obviously if he did something wrong then people would cuss him out..
while obama hasn't even been the president for a year yet
at least leave him alone till he has had a few years in office

[jakncoke]

Every time bush did something wrong heads would roll. but if obama does something we need to leave him alone..

Who are you trying kid, you've had it out for Obama well before he even was officially the president. The innocent card isn't allowed to be played here

[souljaa]

Wow...Jeez..Seriously it's been 8 months...Relax....After all that Bush screwed up, leaving it for Obama...Give him a break....

[RaiDae]

Weird...
(the majority of) Americans vote for their president because they think that he/she will make their country a better place or the voter likes them. Whereas over here, most people vote to keep the competition out of power - we've never liked our primeminister. We vote for the dude who's likely to do the least -inevitable- damage to our country. So when all hell breaks loose nobody's really surprised or disappointed. But 'cos the majority of Americans like and trust the president to make the right descisions and make everything better instantaneously, it seems like a hell of a let down when they fail.

So hey!, Britiain may be pessimistic, but at least it prepared us for the **** atm.

(approval rating for our leading party was 22% on May 15th)

[xmtxm]

He released terrorists from prison.
He gave billions upon billions upon billions of bailouts to Banks.
He gave billions upon billions upon billions of bailouts to car companies.
He spent billions upon billions upon billions of dollars for a Stimulus Package of what, $250 a person to park the economy?
Which, by the way, didn't work.
He is working on National Healthcare.
Which, raises taxes.
Which, makes people who work and earn money pay more.
Which makes them spend less.
Which would make the economy worse.

You said everything right there. Cash for clunkers. Worst program ever. Its a mess. They cant even keep track on how much money they spent. The car sellers dont know if they are going to get there money from the government. Heath plan obama are you an idiot.

Yeah he hasn't been president that long
and sure he made fun of the special olympics but don't other celebrities do that?
where they go on some show or they have a blog or whatever and they make fun of something?
__________________
That crosses the line right there. I totally support mentally disabled people. I volunteer at a therapeutic riding center. There is nothing wrong with them. They are people just like us. I totally support the special olympics.
---
Obama is a horrible president in my opinion.

[Ubernerd]

I used to be so into presidential stuff like this.

But then, I realized it's all pointless. Both sides on the debate are almost always completely wrong.

Nobody can get their facts straight through all the propaganda, and nobody can give straight facts without strong biased overtones in the first place.

[Street_Soldier69]

omg, people the elections are fixed anyway, do you really think they took the "opinion" of over 3,000,000 people to affect the government, ha, the government is just alot of lies, and obama is gonna kill us all and bring the war to the US, better get the shotgun out from under your bed :) .... ur gonna need it..... (my opinion)

[GrandMoff]

Obama's Approval Rating is as low early in his presidency as Bush's was at the conclusion of his presidency. Obama is off on a good start.

/sarcasm.

[rockinfosho1]

Look, President Obama is NOT doing good things. Regardless of whether you're a democrat or a republican, it doesn't matter, the things he is doing go against the ideals of our founders. He has surrounded himself with 37 "Czars", and if you look at the things they're doing/want to do, you'll ask yourself why is he surrounding himself with these kinds of people. For example, Czar Van Jones is a self-renowned Communist, wants a communist country, and he's a 9/11 truther, if you know what that is. And all the things that are happening in the country are just creating a bad situation for us all.

[xmtxm]

Have you guys heard of the Obama education speech. Its about him trying to keep kids in school. It was so funny my history teacher was making fun of the speech. The speech sounds so stupid... What are your guy's opinions.

[Iceskater101]

I don't even know anymore..
I was trying to support obama but its getting harder to do that
I think he needs to pull something out of his but because a lot of the things he has done wasn't that great..

[Street_Soldier69]

i supported obama, at first, and now i ahve REALLY big doults

[Jaykub]

i have major doults lol

[LemonRising]

One question.

Why do you guys hate health care so much?

[Street_Soldier69]

obama gonna get a shoe thrown at him, like bush did.

Better watch ya back obama, i missed bush, but i got better aim with these converses.

YouTube - Bush EXTREME Shoe Dodge (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EegNGbzchyk&feature=channel)

[Jaykub]

People don't think sometimes.
Do you want the government to control if you live or die?

Because I'm sure almost everyone will have a time in there life if something goes untreated and not seen by a doctor you will die. And if you don't have the money for it health care will help you. But the government will own it. And that takes a huge hit out of freedom.

My words are starting to get mixed its so stupid

[LemonRising]

Really?

I duno man

In Canada, it's so relaxing to know, if you get sick, you wont owe some stinky rich doctors a ****load of money.

Not everything's free, but it would be a lot worse if none of it was.

I don't think that they control if you live or die.
Just because your healthcare wont cover it doesn't mean you can pay for the rest, right?
Correct me if I'm wrong, I haven't really looked into his plan, I'm just a little struck at how much backlash he's gotten for it. Curious, perhaps.

I am canadian and I love healthcare.
KEEPS ME BREATHING.
I don't hesitate to go to the doctor if I'm feeling sick because 'I wont be able to afford it'.
you know what I mean?

And you're not free anyways.
not really.
Not saying I am, I'm quite aware that my government is full of ****s <:

[Jaykub]

No the government want just saw aw hell were going to let you die but I will tell you this.

1. You lose your freedom

2. This is the big one. Lets say healthcare is government run and we have another depression then whats healthcare going to be like..... Get my idea?


Then you are as good as dead

[Street_Soldier69]

No the government want just saw aw hell were going to let you die but I will tell you this.

1. You lose your freedom

2. This is the big one. Lets say healthcare is government run and we have another depression then whats healthcare going to be like..... Get my idea?


Then you are as good as dead

you know your gonna hear my childish comment about everything, so here it goes....

when we get that bad ima just start eating people, and jacob your gonna be on my list, and lemonrising aswell. >:)

[LemonRising]

How exactly do you lose your freedom though?


I don't feel like my government owns me every time I take advantage of my healthcare.

And i mean, we just had our whole recession deal-y, and it didn't really affect our healthcare at all.

Like uhh, look at it this way (If I can explain it properly)

Say you have healthcare, get you're regular visits and **** and you're like 'wow hey this is cool I can be healthy and feel better faster, basically for free. (aside from maybe tax, but if you have a major problem you're basically getting it paid back). Then one day the guv's like "oh **** a depression. Okay guys, we need to cut your healthcare a little, you KNOWWWWWW". So whatever, you dont get as much, but if you NEED what they dont cover, you'll end up paying anyways, which is what you've been doing for years. But at least you're getting your basics covered.

They can't REFUSE your right to see a doctor.
Or is that what they're saying, cause then you'll have to give me a source cause then I'll laugh and then agree with why you dont want healthcare.
otherwise i just dont understand D:


P.S. SOLDIER YOU CAN TRY. BUT THERE"S A LOVELY BORDER THATLL STOP YOU.
Plus I can kick your butt.

[LiNuX]

No the government want just saw aw hell were going to let you die but I will tell you this.

1. You lose your freedom

2. This is the big one. Lets say healthcare is government run and we have another depression then whats healthcare going to be like..... Get my idea?


Then you are as good as dead

1. no...

2. there is a huge difference between A depression and THE GREAT depression.

@lemon - they are just misinformed and just going by what Rush Limbaugh tells them. I have tons of family in canada and they all love the healthcare there. Of course you'll hear people like Limbaugh call government controlled healtcare "socialist" then it would mean our neighbors to the north are socialists and where is the fence?

They don't look at the bigger picture on how it would help the nation as a whole, they are just focusing on the "death panel" that decides whether you live or die - and you are right, it doesn't mean that you can't pay for your own healthcare - obama's plan allows you to keep your own plan. Medicare and Medicaid are government run plans and they keep people alive, and you don't hear people complaining about that. The new plan is just to spread those to other people - You can't get medicare unless you are over 65 years of age and you can't get Medicaid unless your entire family income is below a certain threshold. The new plan makes more wiggle room for the rest.

But I'm just ranting now.

[Street_Soldier69]

haha, borders cant stop mexicans, and when the world goes to crap, there will be no border,

also.... can you out run a bullet?

@LiNuX you make me feel stupid

[Jaykub]

I just said they can't keep you from seeing a doctor....

I also don't think you understand how much this will cost. And i don't know whats its like in canada but we like a choice

[LiNuX]

I just said they can't keep you from seeing a doctor....

I also don't think you understand how much this will cost. And i don't know whats its like in canada but we like a choice

1. correct

2. do you know how much it will cost? do you know what half of the tax payer money is spent on? without googling?

3. where did you read in the plan you don't get a choice of doctor or healthcare plan?

[Street_Soldier69]

1. correct

2. do you know how much it will cost? do you know what half of the tax payer money is spent on? without googling?

3. where did you read in the plan you don't get a choice of doctor or healthcare plan?

ima take a wild guess without googling.

tax payers money is spent on...... rebuilding iraq???

[LemonRising]

1. no...

2. there is a huge difference between A depression and THE GREAT depression.

@lemon - they are just misinformed and just going by what Rush Limbaugh tells them. I have tons of family in canada and they all love the healthcare there. Of course you'll hear people like Limbaugh call government controlled healtcare "socialist" then it would mean our neighbors to the north are socialists and where is the fence?

They don't look at the bigger picture on how it would help the nation as a whole, they are just focusing on the "death panel" that decides whether you live or die - and you are right, it doesn't mean that you can't pay for your own healthcare - obama's plan allows you to keep your own plan. Medicare and Medicaid are government run plans and they keep people alive, and you don't hear people complaining about that. The new plan is just to spread those to other people - You can't get medicare unless you are over 65 years of age and you can't get Medicaid unless your entire family income is below a certain threshold. The new plan makes more wiggle room for the rest.

But I'm just ranting now.

That's what I thought.
Healthcare is magical. I would revolt if Canada were to get rid of it.
Jacob, you should seriously be pushing for healthcare.
It's like before, BUT BETTER.

I honestly hope that soon you (and all americans) realize that. There are just so many advantages. Plus, take it from a Canadian, I don't feel any less free than I would without it.
I would feel lost without it.

Iduno man.
Just keep your ears open to both sides.

[Jaykub]

Any that sees that america is 11b in debt and says I GOT A IDEA lets buy everyone old cars and pay for healthcare is not right in there head

[LemonRising]

I'm just gonna take linux's word on this one.


And be VERY HAPPY WITH MY HEALTHCARE.

[Jaykub]

sure it would be awesome to have free health care but it will screw america so bad.

We just can't pay for this "now"

[LiNuX]

ima take a wild guess without googling.

tax payers money is spent on...... rebuilding iraq???

that's a nice guess, and you're close, but no.


sure it would be awesome to have free health care but it will screw america so bad.

We just can't pay for this "now"

what makes you think we can't pay for this?

America may be in debt (thank you Bush's war in Iraq for "freedom" which has NOTHING to do with oil) but it's still one of the richest nations in the world. It won't cost much more than what we already have and as lemon said, it's much better but you would have to actually read the plan before assuming. I've read parts of it but the thing is pretty long. Don't think I'll ever read it word for word, I'm better off having people interpret it (courts). (I read it, because I study law, kinda have to)

[Jaykub]

When america is out of debt then we should do this.....

[Street_Soldier69]

tax payers money is spent on........ weapons for iraq?

(please no one answer, im tryin to get it right without googlin)

[LiNuX]

When america is out of debt then we should do this.....

lol....

1. that's not likely to happen - we've always been in debt

2. national debt is a good thing if it's efficiently handled - just like the Clinton terms.


tax payers money is spent on........ weapons for iraq?

(please no one answer, im tryin to get it right without googlin)

closer. but still a little off.

[Street_Soldier69]

umm..... they spend it on....

healthcare for soldiers?

weapons for iraq?

...... i give up, what is it?

[LiNuX]

the military - like I said you were close - you had the "weapons" there but it's not just weapons - they use the money for military technology, soldiers, stuff for oversea stationed soldiers, etc. more than 50% of the tax payer money goes into the military, I'm sure we can spare some money from there because our military is almost twice as good as the next best (England) - but this country is hungry for militaristic power so I doubt any president will cut spending from that because then the other party will always be like "He doesn't care about our safety, he's cutting from our national defense" blah blah blah.

[xmtxm]

Please we are already in debt. With all the money the government has thrown aways and future debt they are about to put us in we will be in a trillion debt. We are going to move to a dictatorship if Obama is not voted out of office soon.

[LiNuX]

Please we are already in debt. With all the money the government has thrown aways and future debt they are about to put us in we will be in a trillion debt. We are going to move to a dictatorship if Obama is not voted out of office soon.

the national debt is almost 11 trillion...

and what are you basing the whole "dictatorship" thing on?

You can't just blurt out things without knowing how the government works, I hope you know that there are two other branches of government and the most powerful over the other two's decision is most likely the supreme court. They can deny anything and everything they want.

[Jaykub]

no since in keeping this going with you....

also sorry about the b not t

[RaiDae]

I have to agree with Lemon free healthcare is awesome. If it weren't for free health-care i'd probably be long dead. (my neck was slit open when i was a little kid). I had no health insurance or anything, and i feel relaxed knowing if somebody where to stab me or what not, i don't have to pay for the medical bills. Is it not un-fair, paying the medical bills for the person attacked you?

Also, one american tried to prove that the british healthcare system was useless by using Stephen Hawkig as an example.
"People such as scientist Stephen Hawking wouldn't have a chance in the U.K., where the National Health Service would say the life of this brilliant man, because of his physical handicaps, is essentially worthless."

In response to this quote
Stephen Hawking was born and raised in the UK. He lives here and he teaches at the university i'm trying to get into.
If this is what the general public of America thinks, maybe they are as idiotic as their stereotype.

[LiNuX]

Bill Maher has already said this country is stupid - I mean, there are some super smarties out there, I know a few myself, but a majority of the country can't even tell you what the Supreme Law of the Land is even though you study it from early elementary school. And even more people can't tell you the three branches of government, so you can't really expect them to understand something as complex as healthcare.

I'm not trying to offend anyone in particular, but studies do show that even though the US is the strongest and one of the richest countries in the world, it's intellect is really low if you take the average.

Stephen Hawking is awesome. Has done so much for physics and I've studied some of his work for fun, after all, he is the only person to come close to the theory of everything, would be great if he could eventually come up with one.

[Samus-Fan]

I didn't really read any of your other posts, I dunno why we necrobumped.
But anyway.

Nothing in life is Free.
Someone pays for it.
FREE HEALTHCARE FOR EVERYONE.
Paid by YOU.
Which in turn, would raise your taxes.
Which, in turn, makes you have less money right now.
And you can think from there.

Healthcare.
OMG I IS SICK.
I'm gonna go see a doctor.
Get an appointment, done.
Taken Care of.

GOVERNMENT HEALTHCARE.

I is sick.
5439570348957348907 other people think they are too.
We all wanna see a doctor, even for something like hiccups.
It's free, I'm gonna go whenever, I don't have to pay for it.
I actually am sick.
I go to a doctor.
LOL 349578340895734 DAYS UNTIL I CAN SEE YOU HAVE A NICE DAY.
Because everyone goes to see the doctor for stupid reasons, clogs the line, and everyone else suffers.

Let's continue.

Lets say it doesn't work.
Like social security, any government benefit eventually is taken as a "right" by the public, meaning that it's politically near impossible to remove or curtail it later on when costs get out of control.

Health care equipment, drugs, and services may end up being rationed by the government. In other words, politics, lifestyle of patients, and philosophical differences of those in power, could determine who gets what.

Patients aren't likely to curb their drug costs and doctor visits if health care is free; thus, total costs will be several times what they are now.

"Free" health care isn't really free since we must pay for it with taxes; expenses for health care would have to be paid for with higher taxes or spending cuts in other areas such as defense, education, etc.

Government is more likely to pass additional restrictions or increase taxes on smoking, fast food, etc., leading to a further loss of personal freedoms.

Government-mandated procedures will likely reduce doctor flexibility and lead to poor patient care.

[LiNuX]

why do you think taxes are bad? they are good if they are proportional

[LemonRising]

I didn't read samus' post because he didn't read ours.


Which he obviously should.

[Samus-Fan]

why do you think taxes are bad? they are good if they are proportional

You're right.
Taxes are good when they use them to benifit us.

Not bailout and give to Car companies, and banks.

And healthcare would raise the taxes by, last I read, 12% or something, I'll have to look that up.
So no, I don't want to pay for something just so others can use it.


And @Lemon:
You most likely did read my post, but are only saying you didn't because you have nothing to say wrong about it.

[Trunks]

You're right.
Taxes are good when they use them to benifit us.

Not bailout and give to Car companies, and banks.

And healthcare would raise the taxes by, last I read, 12% or something, I'll have to look that up.
So no, I don't want to pay for something just so others can use it.

Not picking on just you, but a lot of Americans think that way. That's why American is known as the most selfish country in the world. A LOT of people think "Why should I pay for something I don't use even if it's helping poor people"

And I'm not discussing anymore, I couldn't care less about politics, just wanted to throw that out their.

[LiNuX]

Not picking on just you, but a lot of Americans think that way. That's why American is known as the most selfish country in the world. A LOT of people think "Why should I pay for something I don't use even if it's helping poor people"

And I'm not discussing anymore, I couldn't care less about politics, just wanted to throw that out their.

that's why everybody else hates this country. we have too many people that are too greedy and selfish. Nobody seems to know that sharing is caring.

@samus - did you turn on the bailouts when Obama went into office? or were you against it when Bush was giving them out last year?

I pay taxes and I don't mind if they use it to help others. I know I would want to be helped if anything bad happened to me or my family member. Money is fragile, you can have it one day and it can disappear the next, doesn't mean you don't deserve to be able to see a doctor when you need it.

And you have to look at it this way, you aren't the only one paying taxes, hundreds of millions of others are paying so that everyone has the shared benefits.

P.S. I don't like paying taxes, but I also know if I don't, I am hurting the nation's ability to provide for me and others.

[Street_Soldier69]

im glad i dont care about this stuff, i live my live and whatever happens in the government im like "meh" and just go on. and i dont see no point and this thread even exsisting.

[LemonRising]

And @Lemon:
You most likely did read my post, but are only saying you didn't because you have nothing to say wrong about it.

Close
I read the first six lines, went "LOL olawd" and then posted.

[RaiDae]

Samus, i am beggining to think that you have an IQ to rival a worm's. Not only are you ignorant, your research is laughable and your selfishness is staggerring.

When i feel ill, i get an appointment to the doctors and, providing it is early enough (aka, not before 3) i can book an emergency appointment for the very same day, or a normal appointment in a couple of days time. And the prescription (which, depending on your circumstances, you will need to buy) is recieved during that appointment, it is your own responsibility to get it when YOU feel like it.

In the A&E (which is where accidents and emergency cases are dealt with) they will always take people in the order of seriousness. Which is perfectly reasonable. My mum had a hip replacement and yes, it did take a while to be seen to. But, it didn't cost us. Is it fair to pay money because of something that you were born with? atm, you say yes. but the day when you get some terrible condition, you will change your mind instantly.

You are a fool, Samus. Not because you don't think it's a good idea, but because you have no idea what you are talking about, with the majority of you're figures and ideas most likely coming from idiots who believe that professor. Hawking is America. and you will not open your mind to anything we have to say on the matter. I would listen to your point of view, if it wasn't so intolerably selfish and utterly fictional.

You will probably comment again without having read this and will ignore anything i have to say, but i cannot make you see truth. It is your own choice to live in your make belive world where EVERY politician and doctor is intent on making your life a misery.

[Exodyus]

Wow ... owned.


Firstly, I'd like to state outright, that if you're not old enough to vote or have paid taxes for more than a year, I don't really think that you have the rights to complain at all, seeing as you're not even a legal adult, if you're at that age.

Coasting on mommy and daddy's ideals and their complains, doesn't really give you the right or reason to criticize, because you're not old enough to really understand half of how things really work in this world.

Secondly, I haven't been to the doctor in about ten years or more, aside from one major surgery, and I'm bias on that, because my dad is the Chief of Perfusion.

Essentially, what I'd say is --

If we need to generalize healthcare, go for it.

There are thousands of illegals that live in the US currently, who are going into the emergency room and being treated because they're not allowed to turn people away -- and then not paying, so our taxes have to pay for it.

I've been working since I was 15. I've been paying hella' taxes for the better part of 10 years now. So, I understand how it is. :/

[LiNuX]

@exo - I somewhat agree with you but I disagree with the point that you have to pay taxes to understand what it's about, and you have to be old enough to vote to understand politics. I may have been the oddball but I've followed politics long before I turned 18. I mean, if you do the right research and listen to the right people and listen to EVERY side, you should have a good understanding of how things are. But most people here seem to post from one point point of view...e.g. Soccer isn't a sport...I read that somewhere - just because you don't play it, doesn't make it any less of a sport - same goes for politics (don't remember where I read the soccer comment, doesn't seem to be in this thread)

[Trunks]

@exo - I somewhat agree with you but I disagree with the point that you have to pay taxes to understand what it's about, and you have to be old enough to vote to understand politics. I may have been the oddball but I've followed politics long before I turned 18. I mean, if you do the right research and listen to the right people and listen to EVERY side, you should have a good understanding of how things are. But most people here seem to post from one point point of view...e.g. Soccer isn't a sport...I read that somewhere - just because you don't play it, doesn't make it any less of a sport - same goes for politics (don't remember where I read the soccer comment, doesn't seem to be in this thread)

It was in the Marching band thread.

I don't even follow politics now, I doubt I'll pay to much attention to it when I turn 18 either. It's just not something I'm interested in. I find it annoying to talk to people with biased opinions that won't listen to one thing that you say and they believe only what they want. In politics, that's about all you get lol. You're like the only person that says things about both sides. Now if only the other 98% of the population would think that way too.

[LiNuX]

I'm not the only one - I've had professors that can speak for both sides, I mostly owe it to them. And of course, Jon Stewart who makes fun of both democrats and republicans...classic.

[RaiDae]

It's quite hard to look at it from both sides. politicians have a habit of saying their oppostion are useless and horrible and wrong and generally evil. And people really believe them. So, in that persons mind the other partys proposals are treacherous and wrong. At least, this is my theory as to why the majority can only see things from one view point.
I try to look at political problems from my own point of view, but frankly the lies and B&llsh*t spread around make it difficult. I tend to listen to friends who support a certain party talk about what that party's doing and squidge them all together to get the jiist of what's going on.
Sometimes i think that having one person make all the descisions would be a godsend, then i remember china. We shall just have to do the best with what and who we've got.

(sorry for any typos)

[LiNuX]

knowing politics and being politicians are two different things - if you know politics, you can argue from any perspective (if you try) - and if you're a politician, you HAVE to argue from your party's perspective, otherwise you'll get trouble from your own party as well as opposing parties.

[Samus-Fan]

I just wanted to throw this out there as well, to people Like Lemon.

The American's Healthcare system isn't gonna be anything like Canada's or France's.
Which are the two that are compared to it.
Because out nation is much bigger than that of Canada and France, we changed it to fit the bigger population.

Sure, you can keep your healthcare plan.
Until (And I'd have to re-check this, I'm not sure if this is it, it might be different) you move, or change your healthcare plan. Once you do that, BAM, you're on government healthcare.

Just gonna throw this out there, since you all think free stuff is the best way to do it. France ALSO has free college, but, Oh, that's right, you don't get to choose where to go. A Test decides which college you go to. The test? The BAC.
You fail the test? You're a laborer.
Great way to make it work!

[RaiDae]

Scotland also has free university education (college) and you chose where to go and what to do (as long as you make the grades, because universitys aren't going to accept people who can't even pass high-school exams). Our system is working fine up here thanks.

Wouldn't it make more sense if America had a general health-care plan and allowed people to take out more expensive and "private" plans if they so desire. Obviously, that's not something you could do much about by yourself.

[Samus-Fan]

Scotland also has free university education (college) and you chose where to go and what to do (as long as you make the grades, because universitys aren't going to accept people who can't even pass high-school exams). Our system is working fine up here thanks.

Wouldn't it make more sense if America had a general health-care plan and allowed people to take out more expensive and "private" plans if they so desire. Obviously, that's not something you could do much about by yourself.

And?
I didn't bring up Scotland, I obviously said, "In France."

And no, it wouldn't make more sense.
Because you're giving money from people who earned it, by having a job, and giving it to Healthcare for people who don't work, or can't afford it themselves.
And then, the people who do pay have to may even more because of taxes.

[LiNuX]

helping people that need it is a special kind of feeling. Not sure if you have any income samus, but when you get to the point, hopefully you realize that money isn't everything.

And people claiming that this would increase our national debt has no idea how a country works. investing in your own people is much better in the long term.

And I don't know how the French college system works so I won't comment on that now - but the goal of our country should be to look at what's WORKING for other countries and implement those plans in our own system. Our education system is pretty good right now - you have freedom of choice (from high-school and on here in NYC, elementary and JHS is decided by where you live) so we shouldn't look at other countries and point out that it's not working for them, we shouldn't care. But healthcare is working for them, and it isn't working for us, why shouldn't we look to bettering the system?

And the new plan is supposed to give you choice - between government and your own private health care if you can afford it - and I'm not sure if you want to have kids in the future, but I know when I have kids, I need to be able to have health care whether it's private or government funded just in case anything should happen to me or to whoever that takes care of the kids. This is a long term plan, not a short term one.

And I have private health insurance now and in the past 5 years or so, I went to the doctor TWICE - both for physicals, one was for a job, and i forgot what my first one was for (something else to do with school) - I pay for nothing - I would rather not have insurance or have a government funded one - either way I'm losing more money and right now, I'd be saving more money if I just go with the government funded health care plan and pay the small tax increase.

[Street_Soldier69]

its hard to loose money right now... when you have already lost it all last year... my dad hasnt had a job in 1 and a half years, if we wouldn't of paid for this house, i'd be living, who knows where right now. I used to be able to go to lets say wal*mart and get a MP3 player if i wanted, now i cant even afford, a new pair of shoes, WTF!!

[LiNuX]

its hard to loose money right now... when you have already lost it all last year... my dad hasnt had a job in 1 and a half years, if we wouldn't of paid for this house, i'd be living, who knows where right now. I used to be able to go to lets say wal*mart and get a MP3 player if i wanted, now i cant even afford, a new pair of shoes, WTF!!

wouldn't it be good if you wouldn't have to worry about your health insurance then?

stuff happens and you can't always predict it - I'm sorry to hear about your dad, and I know many people in NYC with the same situation - it's tough and most of them still have health insurance because they need it - and I can assure you that they are all fighting for an universal health care plan.

[Street_Soldier69]

wouldn't it be good if you wouldn't have to worry about your health insurance then?

stuff happens and you can't always predict it - I'm sorry to hear about your dad, and I know many people in NYC with the same situation - it's tough and most of them still have health insurance because they need it - and I can assure you that they are all fighting for an universal health care plan.

my family has health insurance, we dont use it though, cause when i get sick i never go to the doctor and i just sleep it off.

[GrandMoff]

Welcome to Amerika. Where Congress and the President have the unconstitutional power to fine you for refusing Health Care Insurance, whether it be private or Obamacare.

Question to Obama Supporters who spoke against Bush. How come when Bush extended Executive powers following 9/11, you were outraged. When, though, Obama extends his power to force Health Care onto his plebeians, you don't make a peep?

Hypocrites...figures...

If this offends anyone, so be it. I am a strongly Conservative Republican who is not timid and will speak my mind.